Israel seeks to end Gaza operation unilaterally

46 Comments / 46 Comments

1. Max Said:

   No only the emotionally dysfunctional – as I have explicitly explained

   “The fool says in his heart, there is not G-d”.

2. NormanF Said:

   There always be something worse than Hamas to come along.

   Your were expecting a ” Rose Garden”. [ Sarcasm ]

3. AbbaGuutuu Said:

   Do you think you know better than the famous atheist and professor of the 20th century, Anthony Flew, who was forced to believe in God based on his scientific research and the other scientists?

   “”forced to believe in G-D”. ha ha that’s quite a joke. I guess you have proved you do have a sense of humour.

   The universe is unknowable. I know that from direct experience, Wise humans have understood that since the dawn of consciousness. And I know that no other human can know reality because they have the same limited senses I do.
   So what is your problem.? I am not arguing against the existence of G__D, that’s as dumb as trying to cure Nazis but you are attacking – arguing against the existence of atheists!

   Very strange.
   I would say it looks like you need to impose your belief on others else you feel very insecure about your beliefs because of course beliefs are not based on logic and experience
   So what happened to your faith? You have no faith to be confident in your beliefs it appears.

   Believing in G_D can just be a form of spirituality but believing that G-D personally gave the earth to humans (as honeybee thinks) (ho ho remember that on the last day when the earth survives your extinction – if you are here) or that G_d interferes on your behalf because you are the “good guy” is the road to fatuous arrogant self destruction.

4. Max Said:

   The universe is unknowable – the idea that you claim to know it in the ridiculous form of an anthropomorphic G_D is quite delusional.

   Do you think you know better than the famous atheist and professor of the 20th century, Anthony Flew, who was forced to believe in God based on his scientific research and the other scientists?

5. AbbaGuutuu Said:

   Don’t you think everyone has a belief in something or someone be it in a deity or not?

   No only the emotionally dysfunctional – as I have explicitly explained
   Your failure to understand this isi the source of your problem. I don’t have a problem here, you have.

   You still refuse to address about issues which prove the irrationality of atheism.

   I addressed it – in explicit detail , you can’t understand or accept it , that is your problem.

   The universe is unknowable – the idea that you claim to know it in the ridiculous form of an anthropomorphic G_D is quite delusional.

6. AbbaGuutuu Said:

   You have a fundamental mistake is thinking that everyone has beliefs and atheism is another of your “beliefs” – you can live without beliefs – and if you want to improve yourself, when find you have them – get rid of them.

   Don’t you think everyone has a belief in something or someone be it in a deity or not?

   You still refuse to address about issues which prove the irrationality of atheism.

   Do you believe that life ‘came’ from a lifeless stuff or/and nothing ‘created’ something?
   There are many scientists who believe in the God of the Bible based on science.

7. @ AbbaGuutuu:

   If the Supreme Court declared up is down, I couldn’t care less – it’s just politics.

   You like to post long magical incantations as if that will change reality. You have more a belief in magic than a belief in G_D.

   You have beliefs, living the world with beliefs is a reliance on magic.
   I don’t have beliefs. Empirical evidence tells me there is no reality to the “beliefs” of others for the existence of G_d except ego-driven fantasies and a desperate hope for magic.

   Of course the universe is unknowable – If you want to call the universe G_D – go ahead but to me it’s just the universe. This is the world of spirituality – no need and no evidence of a G_D there.

   There is nothing there to support the theory that there is an anthropomorphic G-D that in which humans are any more important than stardust.
   I don’t kneed to disprove the existence of G-d to be an atheist any more than I need to disprove the existence of the Tooth fairy. I simply don’t have beliefs and this idea of a working assumption of an anthropomorphic G_D is beyond fantasy – a simple fairytale for adults. Very few people have this belief unless they are indoctrinated in it at an early age – it is not natural.

   There is no G-d on your side or anyone else’s -the is a supreme arrogance that will have a fall.
   You don’t need G_D to be spiritual, you don’t need G_D to be Jewish and you don’t need G_D to oppose Fascists and ISlamofascists.

   You can have everything you want including moral values, spiritual teachings a feeling of wholeness and one with the universe – all without anthropomorphic G_ds and actually be better off for it..

   You have a fundamental mistake is thinking that everyone has beliefs and atheism is another of your “beliefs” – you can live without beliefs – and if you want to improve yourself, when find you have them – get rid of them.

8. Max Said:

   Yeah like the Supreme Court is in charge of logic and reason.
   Anything to do with religion as politics is irrational.

   You have not addressed the causes for the irrationality of atheism included in my comment. The US Supreme Court made a decision that Atheism is a religion from legal point of view. What makes it “illogical and unreasonable?”

   According to science and God website: “Atheists say they have the answer to why there is something rather than nothing—the nothing created it! However, their explanation takes science and turns it on its head—performing miracles of creation through unknown physics or mechanisms that are extremely unlikely to occur. The simplest explanation for the existence of all the something we see is that an extremely intelligent being, God, willed it to happen for His own purposes, and left evidence of that purpose in the nature of His creation and His communication with the creatures He created. The important things in life are not derived from the stuff we can see, but from the One who created it.

   The heavens declare His righteousness, And all the peoples have seen His glory. (Psalms 97:6)

   Is it not foolishness, illogical and unreasonable to believe that something “came” from nothing and life came from a ‘lifeless’ stuff?

9. AbbaGuutuu Said:

   Atheism is a Religion Says US Supreme Court.

   Yeah like the Supreme Court is in charge of logic and reason.
   Anything to do with religion as politics is irrational.

10. Max Said:

    AbbaGuutuu Said:

    honeybee Said:
    You say this because you have no faith.
    A person cannot give what he does not have!!!!
    Atheism is a godless and hopeless religion!!!

    “Department of not quite getting the concept”!
    Atheism is not a religion and of course it is G_dless – that’s the point.

    Atheism is a Religion Says US Supreme Court.
    Atheism is a belief in unbelief in a Devine Being.

    “THE IRRATIONALITY OF ATHEISM

    Atheism tends to exalt reason, but it is actually irrational. Atheists tend to put a lot of stock in the emperical method and in logic. One cannot disprove God exists using the emperical method. You might reply: But I can’t disprove a giant purple frog on Mars controls the universe, either. Granted, one can never disprove any given thing exists. The atheistic position denying God’s existence, if based on the emperical method, is absurd. Why do I say that? In order to prove the assertion No God exists experimentally, one would need to comprehensively know all of reality. Comprehensive knowledge of reality is called omniscience. One would need to be omniscient in order to prove there is no God, but if one were omniscient one would, by definition, already be God! So, based on emperical methodology, the only one capable of disproving the existence of God would be God himself! But some would say you can indeed assert something does not exist if its existence is logically self contradictory, such as a square triangle. By definition it cannot exist. It is illogical for something to be a square and to also be a triangle. Again, granted, but this line of reasoning assumes logic and real meaning exist and are our basis for knowledge –something an atheist has no right to assert! The existence of God is not only logically possible, it is philosophically essential. (We’ll get to that more later below.) One cannot prove logic exists unless one first presupposes a God in whom reason and meaning are transcendentally rooted, otherwise these categories are mere philosphical prejuduces. Atheism is inherently self-contradictory. The evidence for the existence of God is there for all to see, only we refuse to see it. King David wrote: The fool says in his heart there is no God. (Psalm 14:1) In other words, Atheism is irrational. Apart from God there is no basis for truth or ethics. For the sake of brevity, let’s simply consider ethics. “

    Read more at: http://www.chaim.org/atheist.htm

11. “If they survive in Gaza it’s a victory because the number of dead people mean nothing to them – they have a billion more and resupply from the Israeli haters is endless.”

    This is the truth, sadly. The rest of the world pretends otherwise, but this is the reality of the war between Israel and Hamas.

12. NormanF Said:

    Ideally, they should be destroyed but the conditions are not yet ripe for it.

    ..not yet ripe?

    25 January 2006 was harvest time every hour since them has been an opportunity missed and justice denied.
    They are terrorists they have no legal authority to exist in the world – they should have need wiped out on day one.

    WHY WEREN’T THEY?

    Did Israeli need more “victories”?

13. My point exactly. We’re dealing with genocidal fanatics. The only thing that will deter them is force.

    Ideally, they should be destroyed but the conditions are not yet ripe for it.

14. NormanF Said:

    Do you expect Hamas to say Israel won, we’re throwing in the towel and giving up on jihad? Then you’re the one living in a fantasy world. The true nature of Hamas will never change.

    Of course not. Therefore they have not lost until they have been annihilated in Gaza.
    So So you could say they have lost if you mean mean they lost their marbles?
    If they survive in Gaza it’s a victory because the number of dead people mean nothing to them – they have a billion more and resupply from the Israeli haters is endless.
    ..
    If you need a sweet dream why don’t you just take some opium while you are waiting for annihilation? The dream will be sweeter and the intrusions from reality much less.

15. @ Max:

    Do you expect Hamas to say Israel won, we’re throwing in the towel and giving up on jihad? Then you’re the one living in a fantasy world. The true nature of Hamas will never change.

16. honeybee Said:

    Israel’s days are numbered – you can only lose so many times before it’s over

    You say this because you have no faith.

    So Hamas has faith it will annihilate Israel
    Therefore according to your thinking method , they are correct -especially because there is more of them than us.

    ….
    Faith doesn’t close concentration camps – only military might does. and if it’s not used then well – forget about it.

    ..
    Faith is for when you’ve done all you can do. It doesn’t and can’t replace critical thought and making changes and efforts.

17. NormanF Said:

    Hamas lost and its trying to save face by accusing Jews of cowardice. I really don’t care and to hear insults hurled at Israel from cowards hiding in bunkers is hilarious.

    Hamas lost???!!! Who accepted their surrender and disbandment? When were the trials?
    Living in fantasy land are we?

    If you take all opinion so personally, you will never be able to think realistically. Nothing can be fixed unless it’s critically analyzed.

18. AbbaGuutuu Said:

    honeybee Said:
    You say this because you have no faith.
    A person cannot give what he does not have!!!!
    Atheism is a godless and hopeless religion!!!

    “Department of not quite getting the concept”!
    Atheism is not a religion and of course it is G_dless – that’s the point.

19. yamit82 Said:

    Israel’s days are numbered

    So are yours.

    I have nothing to do with it, It is an objective opinion.

20. @ watsa46:

    They’re fanatics. What deters them is not a piece of paper but the hammering they took from the IDF. Like Hezbollah, Hamas is slow to learn but its teachable.

21. Genocidal Fanatics give up only when DEAD. IL must now look at J & S and the North for possible tunnels.

22. @ honeybee:

    There always be something worse than Hamas to come along. That’s the nature of evil. But Hamas can now be left to die on the vine. It has no hope of resupply and in the short to medium term, it faces a lot of problems at home. Let it dig itself – or try to – out of its own self-inflicted nakba. Without Israel’s cooperation, nothing will happen. It was never in the cards that Hamas would formally surrender. Israel has decided for now to call it a day and this war is open-ended. If Hamas persists, it will pay a higher and higher price.

23. the phoenix Said:

    After a five-hour meeting Friday, cabinet decides against further cease-fire negotiations, relying instead on restoring Israel’s deterrence.

    Ehm…
    Huh??!
    Someone splain por favor

    Unless we know the factors under the table we cannot understand the cabinet decision.
    what we see is an aversion to deposing hamas and getting in deeper.
    I think that they evaluate the actual expect outcome of each scenario and have figure that right now it is better to have the staus quo AND the conitnuing blockade.

    without an agreement hamas cannot get redevelopment money
    without an agreement hamas cannot get goods without egypt or israeli permission
    without an agreement hamas will most likely have to come out of their holes and confront the damage and the civilians who suffered.
    without an agreement abbas cant come to get his unity gov
    without an agreement hamas will have to demilitarize in order to survive because they cant get anything in with egypts cooperation

    what will be gained realistically under the alternate scenarios
    Israel does not want to deal with ruling the arabs and being responsible for them and at the same time get flack.
    right now the world is on their side especially if they are not killing too many civilians.

    israel is getting the 225 million resupply, it appears, from the US and can keep testing and upgrading the iron dome.

24. the phoenix Said:

    Someone splain por favor

    ” A paradox, a paradox a most convenient paradox.” Gilbert & Sullivan

25. AbbaGuutuu Said:

    honeybee Said:

    Better the devil you know.

    The devils isarel is now desling wiht

    Request has been sent successfully

    The devil Israel is now dealing with is Hamas, who is totally committed to the destruction of Israel and the Jews everywhere. It is not a political organization but ideological and religious. I do not think there will be any other organization (devil) worse than Hamas.

26. honeybee Said:

    Better the devil you know.

    The devil isarel is now dealing with

27. After a five-hour meeting Friday, cabinet decides against further cease-fire negotiations, relying instead on restoring Israel’s deterrence.

    Ehm…
    Huh??!
    Someone splain por favor

28. honeybee Said:

    You say this because you have no faith.

    A person cannot give what he does not have!!!! 🙂

    Atheism is a godless and hopeless religion!!!

29. yamit82 Said:

    Changed your tune have you???

    I thought he was ” tone deaf”. Note NormanF: I placed the sarcastic bit in parenthesis.

30. NormanF Said:

    Hamas annihilated

    Better the devil you know.

31. Max Said:

    Israel’s days are numbered – you can only lose so many times before it’s over

    You say this because you have no faith.

32. @ yamit82:

    For you, an interesting commentary by someone named after a famous Jewish Sage in the Talmud:

    Reader Post: Woe Is Unto Gaza

    Posted by: Elisha benAbuya August 2, 2014

    For immediate translation into Arabic and mega leaflet dump on Gaza, Judea and Samaria in the hope it reaches them at a teachable moment.

    WOE is unto Gaza! Your women weep. Your children cry and stare wildly, covered in the blood of their siblings. Your old men curse at heaven as their homes lie about them in ruins. Where are your young lions? Those who marched in their coward masks last Rajab? How were you reduced to such dishonor? How did such destruction come upon you?

    UNDER your city, like a rat’s lair, are seven full sized copies of the Burj Khalifa, the world’s tallest tower. 160 of your precious children were sacrificed to build them. That is where your young lions are. Scurrying like ( ? ?? ?????) [Spalax ehrenbergi – blind Egyptian mole rats]. Who fooled them into thinking that this was the way a Muslim goes forth to battle?

    KNOW, that like all events, this is the will of Allah. The One has chosen, as the instrument of your humiliation, the smallest and most despised among the nations, the Jews. I am of that tribe. If, for that reason, you close your ears to me, that is your foolishness, your drunkenness, your arrogance.

    ONCE WE, like you today, were arrogant. Thinking that The One was “ours”alone. For this arrogance were we bitterly chastised. Exiled from our home and cast to the four winds, by idol worshippers.

    BUT, we learned from our chastisement. Allah, recalling his covenant with our mutual father, Abraham, did not allow us to perish – though during our banishment many have tried to extinguish us. All have failed.

    NOW, we have been gathered from the farthest corners of the world, by the hand of the Transcendent One, and have been returned, by that Power Alone, to our home, to that place from which the One brought us forth. We bring great treasures of wisdom and science that we’ve collected on our journey. These we would gladly share with you, my brother Ishmael.

    BUT, you must turn, from your arrogance, to the greater jihad. The war to conquer the evil inclination that resides in yourselves, as in us, as in all men. The evil inclination that blames others for their own failures. The evil inclination which values the bauble (puff pastry?) of “honor” over truth.

    “WHAT IS HONOR”? You cannot buy it, but you can sell it cheaply. You cannot inherit it, that honor is your parent’s. You cannot take it with you when you die, a corpse has no honor, it is a heap, a helpless thing.

    YOU may be called to account for what you did with your honor while you were on earth, but if you have squandered it, by acting dishonorably, in drunkenness, it vanishes and can only be recovered with severe toil.

    HOW did this come about? How have you been brought so low? I will tell you how. You were lied to. The Sssserpent Hamasssss played upon your poverty and your desire for honor, plucking your heartstrings, the way a musician plays an oud.

    “WE have the ONLY Truth!” (the serpent says) “March back into the glorious the past!” “The Jews did this to you.” “Anyone who disagrees is against Allah!” “”Anyone who disagrees must die!” “To attain this glorious victory, you must die.” “To achieve this glorious victory, you must sacrifice your children, your women must be made widows and your elderly must live in squalor and the rubble of their homes.”

    AND, if you protest? “We will gun you down in the street, our police will beat you with sticks and we will drag your bodies behind our motorcycles.”

    YOU must do this, YOU must do that, YOU MUST. But we? We will grow rich on the smuggling taxes and on the crooked land deals. While you are kept in poverty and misery, we will wax as rich as the fabled Turkish Sultan, as the ancient Pharaohs.

    Then we will goad Israel until he comes with his hammer to smash you.

    WHILE he does so, we will hide in the basement of al-Shifa Hospital and in our rats lair under your mosques and your homes and your schools, we will fly off to Qatar and consort with prostitutes.

    YOUR destruction, despair and humiliation we will broadcast for the whole world to watch, so that the Europeans and the Americans (who love only your oil and weep for every child who is harmed, no matter by whose acts) will stay the hammer of Israel so that we can repeat our criminal deeds over and over again.

    WHAT is the Law of Allah, delivered to you by Mohammed (PBUH) concerning the habitual thief? Is it not to cut off a hand on one side and the foot on the other? What is the law for the one who makes widows, sends children to their death and condemns the elderly to live in poverty, so that they might become wealthy?

    THIS will be very arduous. The thief does not give up his plunder with a smile. The thieves have all the weapons. But the righteous prevail over the wicked. You must turn to the greater jihad. That is the only path to restore your honor. No one can walk it for you, you must go there for yourself. If any such are your near kin, you must shame them from their path of drunkenness and enticement.

    BE WARNED. Other thieves will come to you with the same make-beleive stories. To make you drunken, once again, with the songs of war. Their flag will be a different color, they will write a different slogan on it, but they will tell you the same lies. They too will hide behind the coward’s mask. The upright, the man of honor has no need of a mask. Only those ashamed of what they do, hide their faces. And you cannot hide from Allah.

    “WE have the ONLY truth!” That knowledge is Allah’s alone. Into the presence of the Infinite Living God there are an infinite number of legitimate paths. Yours will only be acknowledged as legitimate when you acknowledge the legitimacy of others.

    “MARCH back into the glorious past!” Allah has so made us, that time, for us, flows in one direction only. You cannot return to the past any more than you can step into the same river twice. That river has moved on, as time itself moves on. Your glory lies ahead of you. If, and only if, you can cast off the drunkenness of the past, if you will accept that in the past, in drunkenness, you made errors and undertake the arduous work to build yourselves anew.

    “The Jews did this to you!” No, it has been your leaders, Arafat, Abbas, Meshaal who made you drunk with the songs of war while enriching themselves.

    The truth does not require brutal “enforcers”. When you see such you know that there is no truth, no honor, among those who send them at you.

    Mohammed (PBUH) forbade you alcohol, but the blood lust can equally ensnare you and make you its slave. While you are intoxicated, your real enemies, ignorance, poverty, bribes, grow in power and remain unchallenged and undefeated.

    You will know they are buttering you for another penetration when they say: “You must. . .” “You must. . .” Instead, Follow the ones who say “We will act justly, uprightly and we decline the wine of vengeance”. Those who then stand in the forefront of the battle without hiding behind a mask.

    In Peace

    Elisha benAbuya

    Let Hamas boast how it preserved Arab “honor.” True honor is not bought by lies, breaking one’s word and bloodshed. Honor is earned. Hamas perverts are the last folks on earth to teach Israel about honor.

33. Hamas will try to rebuild. Its a given.

    But Netanyahu does not see an upside in retaking Gaza and the Israeli taxpayer would be responsible for rebuilding it.

    No matter what Israel does there are no good options. Only the least of bad ones.

34. If Netanyahu does not crush these filthy, subhuman, Nazi genocidal Hamas savages now, they will be back in three years – this time with chemical weapons.

    So Bibi can wipe them out now, or be forced to nuke them in three years after 10,000+ Israelis die from a surprise sarin gas attack.

    Bibi may be looking for another option. Ultimately, though, there are no options. Hamas has deemed it so.

35. @ yamit82:

    Netanyahu also intimated that Israel has formed closer bonds with some of its neighboring countries over the latest round of fighting, a positive result of the operation which also saw Hamas blamed by much of the international community for breaking a 72-hour humanitarian cease-fire arrangement.

    “No less important, and certainly surprising to many, is the unique relationship formed with countries in the region,” Netanyahu said, noting that “this, too is a very important asset for Israel.”

    “After the hostilities and the end of the campaign it will open many possibilities,” he said.
    http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/183625#.U91EhPldWSo

    this did not just begin in the last few weeks. these relationships have colored everything BB has done the last couple of years including pillar of defense cease fire, Syria, faux peace talks,and especially the decisions being taken right now. BB evaluates all those decisions in the light of how it will affect those relationships he wishes to maintain

36. @ AbbaGuutuu:

    I don’t agree with Max. Hamas lost and its trying to save face by accusing Jews of cowardice. I really don’t care and to hear insults hurled at Israel from cowards hiding in bunkers is hilarious. Its not Israel that’s out of touch with reality; its Hamas. Like Hezbollah, they got a sound thrashing and they will not mess around with Israel again.

37. @ yamit82:

    No. We both know Netanyahu would never topple Hamas. I would like to see Hamas annihilated but at this time its just not worth the prohibitive price. They claim victory anyway – that’s the Arab nature. Armchair warriors who think there is an easy way to do it should go advise Israel. I’m not that arrogant, no matter what you think. I recognize reality and Netanyahu is a risk-averse politician. People who expected him to be Winston Churchill would end up being disappointed. I haven’t changed my view at all, I fully expected him to take the path of least resistance.

38. Max Said:

    Israel’s days are numbered – you can only lose so many times before it’s over

    Why are you so pessimistic? In the face of severe international pressure; when so many Israeli’s are continuously live in fear; when Israel is at war with well known evil (Hamas) – what better solutions do you have than the current Israeli leaders? the days of pessimists and terrorists are numbered.

39. @ NormanF:

    Changed your tune have you???

40. Max Said:

    Israel’s days are numbered

    So are yours.

41. Another victory for Hamas-Iran-Obama.
    Another loss for Israel

    same old same old

    Israel’s days are numbered – you can only lose so many times before it’s over

42. Israel has done all it could. Hamas wants to see people die to rally the world against Israel.

    It loses its main weapon and Israel can inflict more punishing blows by air power if Hamas persists in sending rockets upon Israel.

    Hamas has not attained anything but devastation and death and is losing face in the Arab society. That will be deterrent enough to keep its leaders from tangling with Israel in the future.

43. Watch Live: Netanyahu addresses the nation as army begins withdrawing troops from Gaza
    http://www.jpost.com/Operation-Protective-Edge/Watch-Live-Netanyahu-addresses-the-nation-as-army-begins-withdrawing-troops-from-Gaza-369819

44. Family of captive IDF officer Goldin: Israel can’t leave Gaza without our boy
    http://www.jpost.com/Operation-Protective-Edge/Family-of-captive-IDF-officer-Goldin-IDF-cant-leave-Gaza-without-our-boy-369817

45. rockets not stopped, missiles not destroyed, Al shifah command center not bombed, soldier left behind….
    Too many bldgs and hamas leaders remain intact….
    at least north gaza should be decimated so as to provide no bldgs to return to. then annex north as defensive buffer, let them move south and rebuild south. Gaza city should be flattened.

46. Wait to see what happens. I have also read reports that the IDF will stay in defensive positions up to 3 Kilometers deep in some locations. Let us see what we keep doing in Rafah. Do we take the Philadelphia corridor back?