By Moshe Feiglin
In an interview on Israel’s Channel 2, the broadcaster asked Moshe Feiglin what he would do today if he were PM. Feiglin answered that by turning to the UN, Abu Mazen has essentially declared the nullification of the Oslo Accords. Moshe Feiglin would jump at the opportunity to formally announce the end of the cursed Oslo Accords and declare absolute Israeli sovereignty over all of Judea and Samaria. The Arabs living there could enjoy the same status afforded to the Arabs living in East Jerusalem.
“We are being dragged into impossible dilemmas because of the Oslo Accords, in which Israel essentially recognized the ‘Palestinians’ as the just side of the equation, with Israel being some sort of foreign occupying force,” said Feiglin. “This has slowly but surely brought about the erosion of our sovereignty to the point where we are willing to release hundreds of murderers and their accomplices back onto our streets, among Oslo’s many other ills.”
“Currently, the same Oslo mentality has dragged Jonathan Pollard into this bubbling cauldron as a bargaining chip,” Feiglin continued. “Pollard, a true Israeli hero and man of principle must be disconnected from all other issues. If we would believe in our own justice and right to the Land of Israel, Jonathan Pollard would have been here years ago. Remember, tens of US spies – who have done real damage to Israel – are at work in our country at any given time. We could quietly get Pollard back with no further ado – if we would believe in our own rights and respect ourselves,” Feiglin hinted.
@ yamit82:
This was part of original comment I believe you misread this.
@ yamit82:
I do not want to add more Arabs to the state. I nor Bennett are for the IDF changing what they do in Area A. I made an incorrect assumption I wrote something briefly assuming knowledgeable people would know Bennett’s plan. We are not talking about a state but allowing basically local government functions autonomously in Area A by the locals. Overall security functions would be done by the IDF.
This is not a perfect plan as Bennett says as such a thing does not exist. It prevents a Palestinian State and allows and allows for security and stability. It also applies Israeli law to all Jewish Towns (Y/S) and allows for unlimited Jewish building in Judah and Samaria (Area C).
Maybe you believe that you can have the Arabs magically disappear ( I am not against this) but I do not know where such a magic wand exists. If you can make them go away I would be for annexing Area A. I am not against this if circumstances somehow change.
@ Bear Klein:
No kidding?
Tell’um to take out from the Kiriah, Building 4, 3rd floor, Sgan Aluf Y T file cabinet, second row from the top, the road blocks and field deployment maps and set them up again.
Ask Barak the landlord now and Barak the IDF PR officer at that time, for more details.
See, I can also do some kidding…
Now seriously, (as if nothing before was), does he plan to cut electricity to Peres and Livni’s and your liege’s “partners” and or collect the billions they owe?
How about the promise to build on E1? OK. Let the owners of the two real estate properties he expelled the Jewish owners from return as the court ordered, to their homes?
Anyway, when do you guess will he re start the farce?
Feiglin does not stand a chance in the Likud because he only knows how to talk and talk is cheap.
The peace process with Kerry is dead. I told you so. There is nothing to worry about because it shows how skillful BB is at destroying Israel’s enemies. Livni is now history in the next elections. Obama is now off our back and Kerry proved himself to be a failure. Abu Mazen proved he is no partner, once again, and Israel showed the world once again, that if we are talking real peace, we are for real. Is the pressure over? Of course not, but we have a respite until the next fool tries to force peace on Israel at our expense. If any of you think this was not part of a well rehearsed process by BB and his people, you underestimate the man who will soon set a record for being PM longer than any other person since 1948. I call that impressive. Most European countries cannot make that claim and they have no where near the pressure and problems Israel has. Will he be the leader that builds the 3rd Temple? No. The one that tears down the Rock? No. The one that ensures that we observe the shmitta year as written in the Torah and not through the hocus pocus of the rabbis? No. But he is without a doubt God’s choice to be leading Am Yisrael at this point in time. If you don’t like it, complain to God. Maybe you know better than Him.Some on this list write as though they do know better.
Yaalon and Bibi have tasked the IDF command to see how they could seal area C off from the rest of Y/S.
@ beniyyar:
I agree on that Mr. Feiglin does not stand a chance in that cesspool. Regrettably Netanyahu and his ilk is still in there. Not for long though. I understand that another population shift has taken place in the likud by importing masses of yeine elements. That was done a few times before to prop “ethrogim”.
Not for a second Jews may trust the speechster with a penchant for cardboard props and large red markers. Trusting Netanyahu is tantamount of trusting Livni and Lapid, or Barak and Peres.
The hiatus on the surrender process is just a short pause.
Thankfully Feiglin has no chance whatsoever of being elected Prime Minister so all he can do is rant and rave and make his silly and unrealistic blather.
AbbaGuutuu Said:
Maybe yes maybe no. Speculation, and even if true we may not be their first target of choice. That said, I would not take any chance that I might be wrong. They threatened us and that’s enough to preempt and incinerate all of Iran. Of course I would target every Arab, European, and American capital just in case one or more tries to retaliate against Israel. Mecca and Medina and the Vatican would also be on our target acquisition list which we would announce ahead of time.
In for a penny in for a dime.
@ Ted Belman:
Ted, I trust the updated data that you received from Ettinger. Has defined Shomron and Yehuda including only the three areas defined in the Oslo Agreement, or has he included Arabs living in the annexed parts of Jerusalem?
Either way, I think this factor gives added weight to the annexation process I have suggested, which is to take control over all Shomron and Yehuda, but arrange to govern the Arabs in the seven large urban centers through the local clans. Annexation is a must, but citizenship lightly tossed to within reach of a relatively large and still hostile population is another matter.
Arnold Harris
Mount Horeb WI
ArnoldHarris Said:
I haven’t inflated their numbers but it’s really irrelevant. The real problem are the Arabs in Israel whose demographic in ages 1-11 make up 35% of the population today. How? Arab women begin having children from ages 15-16. By the time a Jewish Israeli has her first child the Arab woman has 2-3 children. The statisc even out on a bell curve towards the end of the bell curve but that includes a larger aging population because Jews live longer than Arabs and many immigrants arrived in Israel already in advanced age. Add to that some half million non Jews awarded Israeli citizenship who are not Jews which reduces the net Jewish actual numbers in fact. In 10 years the Arabs will have 35% voting age Arab minority who can influence the nature of the country and could align with other non-Zionist parties or parties of convenience and actually take control of the government, revoke the law of return and change the Jewish dominant nature of the country. Nowhere else does a coherent minority number one fifth of the population—and growing. Like in a nuclear chain reaction, there is a threshold in societal relations: a minority which remains reasonably loyal at 1-2% of the population grows combustible at 20%. Third-generation Muslim immigrants don’t make France any less French; Arabs make Israel completely un-Jewish. Arabs in Israel don’t pay taxes and don’t take building permits. They don’t serve in the Israeli army or perform civil duty. Israeli courts routinely accept their false testimonies against the Jews—and sentence the Jews who defended themselves. Arabs enjoy the strong institutional protection of the Israeli left. Arabs in Israel receive huge welfare payments, enjoy virtually free health care and education, and breed, breed, breed. They breed to become a majority and a master race in Israel.
In addition to the Arab problem we have in Israel close to a million foreign workers live in Israel, 20% of the Jewish population. They cannot be eradicated easily: their children go to Israeli schools, and they intermarry heavily with Israelis and acquire citizenship through other channels. There is every indication that a large number of them will eventually be naturalized. Though Israel lacks formal legislation for family reunions—largely to avoid swarms of Arabs—the Supreme Court will certainly dictate such legislation to the Knesset in response to human rights petitions. A million foreigners from poor countries, if entitled to bring in their relatives, will definitely do so, inundating Israel with 3rd world pagans.
I understand Russians who don’t want to see Jews around, even though we have lived there for centuries. Likewise, I don’t want to see a single Arab in my country.
They have 22 countries of their own, free of Jews. And Jews should not be the only suckers in the Middle East to tolerate aliens in our own country.
Eric R. Said:
If Iran achieves a nuclear capability, it won’t hesitate to use it against Israel because of its religious beliefs. The Marxists and Muslims in France are real threats to the Jews. Do you think France would act in similar fashion like the mullahs of Iran? The Jews in France have their own country to go to unlike 1945.
Ted My comment to Klein has been blocked by spammer.
Bear Klein Said:
Look at the map of Israel and then a topographical map. Then tell me what borders can be secure? Walls have been breached and a simple kassam can fly over they can dig under. Israel is incapable of securing such a border. We don’t have the manpower either. All of Israel with our backs to the sea is surrounded on three sides by 300 million Arabs who want us dead. You want to add 1.66 million more Jew hating Arabs to our country? That’s insane. Would America invite half million Al Qaeda hard core terrorists and their families to live in America and enjoy all of the entitlements afforded to every citizen and permanent resident? Such an idea ignores the dangers and seems to rest on myopic disconnect with our reality. Every Palis poll indicates the Hamas will win any honest election in Y&S and that’s why Abbas has not called such an election for the past 6 years not that I view any significant difference between Hamas and Fatah.
Ettinger does not credit age discrepancies. Arabs have more children than Jews because Arab women have children from their mid teen and by the time a Jewish woman has their first child an Arab women has had 2-3. Ettinger does not credit the Jewish population has a larger elderly population than the Arabs like we have a life expectancy of 6-8 year longer than the Arabs so in the ages up to 11 years the Arabs in Israel have 35% of the total Israeli demographic, it only evens out towards the middle of the Bell curve. so in the next 10 years the Arabs will be able to produce 33% eligible to vote. You don’t have to be in the majority to take control of the government or the national agenda. 33% plus the extreme Israeli left could forge a coalition with the Arabs forming a decisive anti Jewish and anti Zionist majority and all this without the Arabs from Y&S and Gaza.
@ Eric R.:
Outside of Israel Germany has the fastest growing Jewish population.
Any Jew still living on the continent of Europe gets what they deserve. There is no cure for stupidity and as for greed? Good luck. They made their bed…. Go F… themselves. I belong to the ‘scala’ that no Jew should be anywhere but the Land of Israel and anyone who refuses to come to Israel while they can, safely and with all their accumulated wealth shouldn’t cry when they close the exits and take their wealth. Those Jews cannot be our responsibility or major concern. We got enough on our plates here. There is a big difference between Russian and Eastern European Jews blocked from leaving by their governments and or persecuted through no fault of there own and those able to come to Israel free of charge and subsidized in resettling in Israel by the Israeli government and refuse. Boggles the mind if you view it in it’s historical context. Every Jew still clinging to the exile can rationalize and justify their refusal and I am aware of all the reasons and excuses.
Centuries ago the great Spanish poet and philosopher said: “that if a Jew really wanted to be in the Land of Israel he would walk all the way” and in the past many Jews did just that. Yehuda Halevi died shortly after arriving in Palestine in 1141. Halevi is considered one of the greatest Hebrew poets, celebrated both for his religious and secular poems, many of which appear in present-day liturgy. His greatest philosophical work was The Kuzari.
@ Ted Belman:
Just now I realized how to make sure about the actual number of vermin that we are talking about… 🙂
Invite w/o recourse them all to near the bridges leading into Jordan and the gates to Lebanon, etc, and count them as they vamoose across. That way the mystery about their numbers would be solved…
@ ArnoldHarris:Recently Tom Wilson wrote an article in Commentary about annexing J&S. He was dramatically wrong in one thing he said and I posted his article with my correction at the top. Then I wrote to Ettinger to confirm my understanding of the facts and he wrote back to say the latest number for Y&S is 1.66 million.
Yamit’s concepts are the correct ones. We are involved on a real time war. If I recall correctly only two Islamic countries pretended to sign peace treaties with us and both would not for a second hesitate to join the rest to destroy us.
The rest are in a state of declared war against us. Including the Islamic fabricated bestial murderers aggregate living in Y & S and other areas of Eretz Israel.
All of their common planning and actions are crafted to destroy the State and all of us.
End of story.
Our sole option is to preempt. The enemy must be samehow eliminated BEFORE they do that to us. Classic warfare precept. It just happens to also be a Biblical injunction.
Fear mongering against acting to WIN the war is one of the tools used by the unJews all along. It must be utterly rejected. It brought us to the disaster were we stand today.
There is no possible way to co-exist even if a 30′ concrete wall separates the monsters from us.
Jews massacred in Europe or in any other section of the Diaspora.
With great pain I must say that it is their own doing and they must face the music they themselves composed. Why would any sane human being remain in or return to live in Germany, Austria, Poland, Latvia, Hungary, France, Spain, England, etc, after the palpable, recorded, solid evidence of monstrous hatred against us/them, beats me. Greed? Their problem. They can return and settle the whole of Eretz Israel. And reproduce normally… If they would have done so, the excrement from Islam would have been long back to their sand pits in Arabia, Sudan Syria, Africa, etc.
The war must be won. The alternative is not walled mega walled camps.
Why is my above comment in moderation? Pretty moderate.
The most that can happen in the reality of Israeli politics is Bennett’s plan to annex Area C or something similar ( I like Ted’s idea of taking what you need of Area B for secure borders). Keep the option of Annexing Area A for the future. Israel needs to maintain security control here (as per Bennett’s plan).
Israel can not realistically deal with 1 1/2 million Arabs as residents or citizens of Israel. Luckily this concept is not accepted by more than a minority of Israelis.
Neither Feiglin’s plan nor expulsion of Arabs in Y/S (short of a life and death war)is realistic.
@ yamit82:
You are right about not offering Israeli citizenship to too many Arab enemies. But I think you have exploded their numbers. Careful research of Ettinger’s demographics is that there are about 1.4 million Arabs resident in Shomron and Yehuda outside Jerusalem, which, of course, was annexed 46 years ago.
If I were Feiglin, I would suggest starting with annexation of the 62 percent of Shomron and Yehuda comprised by Area C of the presumably-dying Oslo Accords. Along with that, I would take direct control of whatever parts of Area B needed to insure Israeli access to all parts of Area C, and in order to further fracture whatever would be left of Fatahland. The main purpose of this action should be to break up the PA. In order to achieve that, as soon as all of Area C and parts of Area B are taken, I would begin separate negotiations for local autonomy with the chiefs of the Arab urban clans (Hamulas) in the main cities of Jenin, Tulkarem, Nablus, Kalkilya, Ramallah, Jericho and Hevron. Once they seen that the annexations cannot and will not be undone, it should prove easy to deal with each of those clans on a separate basis. Do some quick reading of the works of Dror Ze’evi, who describes these clans in great detail. What we want to do here is to replace one relatively powerful gang with seven little and relatively easier to control gangs. In order to maintain their status, Arab clan chiefs need money coming in any connections with the governing authority, which in this case will be the government of the State of Israel. And yes, being raised in Chicago taught me early in life that anybody can be bought.
The underlying main principle in the above-cited suggestions is that Israel and the Jewish nation must take back the initiative in the long war against the Arabs in particular and the Moslem world in general. “Taking the initiative” means Israel must do the attacking so that the enemy must respond to the Jewish national game plan, rather than the Jews responding to them, which is what seems to happen all the time and needs to be reversed.
A few decades of all this, and certainly before the end of this century, Israel will have a large enough population to fill up all these new lands. Each of these Arab cities can be surrounded with multiple rings of Jewish suburbs. That’s what haShem created urban sprawl for.
As for Jews paying Arab families to have more babies, that’s what local autonomy is for. They will have to pay for their own social services.
I think Eric R must be having a bad afternoon to write what he did in the above comment. But as for expelling 1.4 million of them across the international borders, it sounds glorious to talk about, but nobody in power in Israel will ever have the guts to implement it.
Arnold Harris
Mount Horeb WI
Yamit,
The transfer solution will cause Jews to be massacred all over Europe, precipitating possibly a second Holocaust that includes Israel, and give Hitler his final victory. What would Israel do against France, a nuclear power, if she allows her Muslims and Marxists to exterminate the Jews? Israel could not nuke France, as she would be wiped out with 50-60 French H-bombs. All of Israel would be turned into a crater, and France (like Iran) if it got to that point, would not mind losing 20-30 million of her own people in a Samson Option if it got rid of Jews forever.
The best you could really do is unilaterally impose borders around the major settlement blocs and East Jerusalem, and evacuate the 60,000 or so settlers that live outside them. Then building a 20′ wall along the new border and tell the Palestinians that they can no longer work in Israel. Let the EU (bankrupt as it already is) support its beloved fellow Nazis.
Feiglin is worse than BB. He would give permanent residency to over 2 million Arabs who hate us, allow them to work and travel anywhere in Israel and to even live anywhere in Israel. That is suicide. It will destroy the fabric of our culture and endanger ever Israeli Jew and especially our daughters.
Only Transfer will work. We can’t afford another 2 million Arabs on our entitlements rolls and the ZIONIST absurdity of we Jews paying monthly stipends for Arabs to have more children, then complaining about the Arab birthrate and the necessity of giving up land with too many Arabs because it will endanger the Jewish character of a majority Jewish state which would be statistically threatened.
A pretender to Leadership of a Jewish State must confront the difficult question re: 40% of the population being anti Israel and anti Jewish minority. For every problem Feiglin hopes to solve he opens a Pandora’s box for other even more serious problems.
If he assumes a Halachic position re: How Israel should act towards the Arabs or any other non Jew in the State of Israel. His stated position would be different.
Some Halachot regarding non-Jews in Eretz Yisrael Compiled by Tzipora Liron-Pinner from ‘The Jewish Idea’ of Rav Meir Kahane, HY”D
When Hashem, your G-d, will bring you to the Land to which you come to possess it, and He will thrust away many nations from before you […], you shall not seal a covenant with them nor shall you show them favor (“lo techanem”). (Deut. 7:2)
[Regarding this we find in] Avodah Zarah 20a: “You must not give them any consideration ” (Deut. 7:2): Do not give them a foothold [“chanayah”] on the land. Alternately: Ascribe to them no charm [“chen”. Rashi: “Do not say, ‘How fine this non-Jew is!’”]. Alternately: Give them no free [“chinam”] gift. Later on the Talmud concludes, “All are valid.” An additional restriction appears in Rambam, Hilchot Avodah Zarah 10:3,4: We do not sell them houses and fields in Eretz Yisrael… neither do we lease fields to them… Why were our sages strict regarding fields? It is because [leasing them to non-Jews] has two [negative results]: It diminishes the tithes and gives non-Jews a foothold on the Land. We are allowed to sell them houses and fields outside the Land because it [any foreign land] is not our land. It is thus clear that there are two reasons for the Torah prohibition against selling houses, or even leasing fields, to any non-Jew, even if he be one of the righteous gentiles [a ger toshav].
The gurrrrrrrrrgling sounds of the accursed nonagenarian must no more be heard!!!!!!
I find nothing wrong with any of Mr. Feiglin’s positions.
Will the combina allow him to advance to that level?