Keeping Up With The Anti-Joneses

By Ted Belman

A few days ago I cautioned that readers should not automatically embrace what Debbie Schlussel had to say. Within hours I got an abusive email from her. More on this later. But it caused me to have a discussion with Lawence Auster, View from the Right. He brought to my attention his post on Keeping Up With the Anti-Joneses. A great read.

Here are some of the people who are among the anti-Joneses; Sarah Palin, Brigette Gabriel, Pamela Geller, Bill O’Reilly, Michelle Malkin, Dan Reil and Glen Beck. Included is what they had to say and the inevitable fisking of their remarks.

September 14, 2010 | 55 Comments »

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  1. . (Americans will know Katyushas)

    HARDLY, think at a min. car bombs like the first WTC bombing. CBN weapons, whatever they can make buy or steal. It might not be needed as America is beginning to look like Eurabia.

  2. Might as well go with the flow. I’m surprised the growing level of awareness it seems to be spearheading or rallying.
    When the commonsense of the people outweighs the propaganda machine of the top they might start to reverse the Islamic conquest. In the final phase there will be armed Jihad spearheaded by the immigrant communities against the last remaining American holdouts. (Americans will know Katyushas)
    They need to get control before that phase occurs.

  3. It is the beginning of the grass roots movement which will lead the opposition to Sharia. This is a bottom up effort. It is needed because the top has sold us out.

    Don’t think so, You’ve shot your loads in defending their rights but appealing to the propriety of building on this one site.

    They will pocket your ( Those who protest propriety and not Islam ) and the next time you will be accused of racism and Islamophobia. Whether the GZM is built or not they win.

  4. I too agree with Debbie except for one thing. Sometimes, battles are worth fighting even if there is no chance of victory. In the case of the Mosque, fighting is just as important as winning. Most Americans identify with the cause. It makes it easier to mobilize them. It is the beginning of the grass roots movement which will lead the opposition to Sharia. This is a bottom up effort. It is needed because the top has sold us out.

  5. I hate to say it, but while I think that Debbie Schlussel is crazy on accusing many people, she might be right about the GZ mosque. These devils are determined to build it. They have the money, the belief, the fervor, and the power of the politicians that are backing them up. From the illegal alien in the White House to the dhimmi Yahud local politicians like Mayor Bloomberg, and Representatives like Anthony Weiner (who just married a Muslim), Gary Ackerman, Jerrold Nadler, and the Manhattan Borough President, Scott Stringer. And one other thing that she was right about when criticizing Gabriel. After Benazir Bhutto was assassinated, Gabriel wrote a very flattering article about Bhutto and how she represented moderate Muslims. Gabriel called Bhutto “a perfect example of an honorable Muslim woman.” She also said that she was a “proud Muslim.” It was so stupid and inaccurate that the website where it had been posted had to scrub the article. However, it can still be retrieved.

    Bhutto and her husband were great friends of Arafat. And they ran Pakistan like it was their own little fiefdom. Let’s not forget the fact that under her first regime in the early 1990’s, the Taliban were created. Towards the end of her life, she tried to portray herself as a moderate. But if she was a friend of Yasser ibn Hitler Arafat, then it is axiomatic that she was an Enemy of Israel.

    Having said that, yes, Gabriel has put up with a terrible amount of hate in her defense of Israel. The question remains though. Is she playing to whatever audience she is talking to?

  6. A very reasonable article.

    And so true it is depressing.

    The cancer has spread and metastasized

    There’s a good word for it.

    911 is starting to look like it smashed and killed America, It’s been all down hill from there. The enemy just moved in and took over.

  7. Debbie Schlussel has been known to blast every conservative blogger who gets more attention then her. She’s done a number of HIT PIECES on Pamela Geller, Walid Shoebat & now Brigitte Gabriel. She said in one of her columns that was Stupid & a waste of time, to protest the Ground Zero Mosque. So this is the quid-essential “Pot calling the kettle black” Enough Said.

    I doubt you read the article. If you have then go to the substance of her arguments and respond to her reasoning not a two liner or three and no information other than the quote from above.

    Here is her article and I can’t find much fault in her reasoning except I would based on 20/20 hindsight fight the mosque but also would oppose any mosque like Schlussel being built.

    Here is here article for your and anyone else who might be interested if just for the sake of truth, when quoting mostly out of context opinions of those you don’t like:

    May 13, 2010, – 4:04 pm
    To Those Opposed to the Ground Zero Mosque

    By Debbie Schlussel

    For about a week, I’ve been getting e-mails from people asking why I haven’t commented on the Muslims building a mosque at Ground Zero, right near the former home of the World Trade Center. They bought the site of an empty Burlington Coat Factory and will spend over $100 million to build their shrine to the moongod cult. It’s ironic that the store is closed because Americans and New Yorkers didn’t see to it that business was quickly rebuilt and bustling at the site of the 9/11 attacks. But the business of Islam has been chugging along the whole time with a lot of help from crappy people on both the left AND the right who still refuse to condemn Islam, but just “a few radicals” and “Islamists,” a phony and dishonest word. Ditto for “radical Islam,” a redundant phrase. They keep telling us the BS they know is fertilizer: that “most Muslims” are against terrorism. Among them are not just Muslims and lefties but Sean Vannity, Sarah Palin, Daniel Pipes, Bill O’Reilly, etc. If you support or listen to any of these people, you are part of the problem of the Ground Zero mosque and have no right to complain.

    I’ve said nothing about the Ground Zero mosque because even though I don’t like the mosque going up there (or anywhere), I don’t think there’s a case here. It’s too late, and it’s a waste of time to whine about it. And we brought ourselves to this point. We need to pick causes and battles where we will actually be victorious. Many of those opposing the Ground Zero mosque were part of the problem b/c they did nothing for 8 of the last 9 years, since a Republican was their President. Again, they miss him and fawn over false memories of safety and security that brought us here. I don’t miss him yet . . . or ever. The time to stop barbarians was before they were at the gate. Not once they were inside of it and held the deed. The people who did nothing for almost a decade are now circulating petitions against the mosque. Will they teach jihad at the mosque? Of course. That’s what they teach at every mosque and Islamic school in America, none of which these people did anything to stop. Now, it’s a waste of time. Will do nothing to stop it. If you are against mosques at Ground Zero, you should be against them everywhere in America, as I am, and against Muslim immigration to America. So where have you been on that for the last 9 years, during most of which Bush was Prez?

    For eight years, we had a President–who claimed to be the counterterrorism Prez–who did nothing to stop Muslim immigration to the U.S. He, in fact, increased it through visa lotteries for underrepresented (read: Muslim) countries, through quadrupling the number of Muslim student visas, and through handcuffing Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) agents and largely keep them from arresting Muslim illegal aliens. Now, we have a President, who is continuing those policies, because he said he would. He’s kept his word.

    Yes, I blame Bush and not Obama because: Read More

  8. @ssim- I share all your views.

    If Americans are stupid enough to accept Islam as part of the “Judeo-Christian/Anglo” character of America, then they are a bunch of fools

    .

    Yes, and I have absolutely zero guilt that they should die and even it is better for the rest of us if they get killed off. Maybe that suicide gene they are carrying will be expunged from the gene pool.
    It’s only unfortunate they take the innocent with them. But even that is not my fault.

    The same goes for the cowards that negotiate with terrorism. – not only negotiate but prostrate acquiescing to their demands – like releasing 1000 terrorists for tow piles of bones or going to even worse for Shalit. They should have traded 1,000 dead terrorists for a video of Shalit not 20 live ones (It would have worked too). With such cowardice Israel condemns itself to extinction. What is the use of trying to help such self -destructive people?

    His family sickens me, Instead of petitioning the ?Government to surrender to Islam they should be petitioning them to execute ten Hamas prisoners a day until he is returned.

    We know what we have to do to survive as individual and as nations. You can never negotiate with freedom or terrorism. If you do you are lost and those who do so I cut all strings with them – never let anyone else taek you down no matter who they are.
    Basic rules of survival.

  9. Debbie Schlussel has been known to blast every conservative blogger who gets more attention then her. She’s done a number of HIT PIECES on Pamela Geller, Walid Shoebat & now Brigitte Gabriel. She said in one of her columns that was Stupid & a waste of time, to protest the Ground Zero Mosque. So this is the quid-essential “Pot calling the kettle black” Enough Said.

  10. Max,

    We are truly living in sick times. I don’t know friend from fiend. All I know is that the Muslims appear “untouchable.” You can’t say a damn thing against them. If you do, you are “racist, extremist, and Islamophobiac.” People get what they deserve. If Americans are stupid enough to accept Islam as part of the “Judeo-Christian/Anglo” character of America, then they are a bunch of fools. The goal of the Muslims is to turn the United States into “al-Jumhuriyah al-Islamiyah al-Amerikiyah.” Whether it takes four more years, or forty more years. Regardless, they are well on their way with the “Man from Mekkah” who now occupies the Green (sorry) “White” House. Reagan recognized the “Red Menace.” It is time for people of all good will to come together and understand the “Green Menace” that is upon us. They are a chameleon. In WWII, they allied themselves with the Nazis. After, with the Communists. It’s all the same. A totalitarian system that dictates to man and woman what and how to do everything. In any event, we the Jews are the target of them all. The real danger with Islam is that they see us as the enemies of “allah.” And so, it comes down to a religious war. They understand it. Unfortunately, we don’t. It comes down to “Islam Uber Alles.” They are the “ubermenschen” and we are the “untermenschen.” We better wake up fast, or we will not wake up at all.

  11. Perhaps it’s something psychological. They are so tired of being denounced as “Islamphobes” (a new term that we’re gonna have to get used to), that they appear to relish their condemnations of Jones.

    Interesting.
    Yeah – Isn’t it a relief to have a socially approved hate outlet? Not allowed to denounce American Jihadism but hey it’s OK to take it out on the pastor.

  12. Randy – Let me pitch you a story!

    For 48 hours the fate of the world was held in the hands of a Redneck Religious Madman! It was a close one. The assassination squads waited for the signal, CNN staked out the preacher, Obama waited by the red phone afraid to offend anyone. At the last moment a threatened mortgage loan recall saved the day!

    The movie will be out in two months. Brad Pitt will play the preacher, Morgan Freeman will play Obama,Harvey Keitel will play the secretary of defense, Donald Trump will play himself, Sandra Bullock will be the Real Estate Agent that saves America – directed by Quentin Tarantino.

    A true American story!

    (Though some 5,000 infidels perished in riots during the filming of this movie it is guaranteed no Korans were burned or harmed in any way.)

  13. Thanks, Max. Agree with your comments too. I’ve been hearing through the grapevine that Brigitte Gabriel is getting alot of flack for her virulent denunciation of the Pastor. This comes from people in her own group. It would be nice if she issued a clarification, but she seems to have such a strong and combative personality, that I doubt that she would admit to going overboard on Jones. (Not that it’s bad to have a strong and combative personality when you’re up against Islamic terror, but please don’t do a “180” and now portray yourself as a moderate.) Even Geller’s denunciation, while bad enough, didn’t seem to be as vehement as Gabriel’s. It’s almost as if they are enjoying themselves in denouncing this guy. Perhaps it’s something psychological. They are so tired of being denounced as “Islamphobes” (a new term that we’re gonna have to get used to), that they appear to relish their condemnations of Jones. It’s as if they are saying to the PC crowd “See, we’re moderates and normal. Guys like Jones and those who support him are the nuts.” They don’t realize that the left might give them a pat on the head for now, but in the end, they will eat them just as much as they will eat up Jones and anyone who dares question the “religion of peace.” (Thank you George W. for coining that phrase. You should have had it trademarked and put on t-shirts.) Sickening.

  14. For 48 hours the fate of the world was held in the hands of a Redneck Religious Madman! It was a close one. The assassination squads waited for the signal, CNN staked out the preacher, Obama waited by the red phone afraid to offend anyone. At the last moment a threatened mortgage loan recall saved the day!

    The movie will be out in two months. Brad Pitt will play the preacher, Morgan Freeman will play Obama,Harvey Keitel will play the secretary of defense, Donald Trump will play himself, Sandra Bullock will be the Real Estate Agent that saves America – directed by Quentin Tarantino.

    A true American story!

    (Though some 5,000 infidels perished in riots during the filming of this movie it is guaranteed no Korans were burned or harmed in any way.)

  15. What pushed me over the edge was the persistent groveling and almost begging of the US Government (politicians, dept. heads, generals, etc.), media, and other VIPs, before this person who before would have been seen as a little insignificant nobody. Did they put anywhere near the same pressure or show the same level of condemnation in dealing with the imam over the mosque? The appearance of the Western world in this whole ordeal is one of submission. That is far worse than ignoring a small church in Florida while they burn the Koran. VIPs made this into something big when it would have gone away.

  16. Why is it when they burn people these same icons of the conservative right are mostly silent or at best selective in their denunciations but

    burning a Book? Animates them all to go ballistic, publicly denouncing their own? Are they really in fact their own?

    Maybe some are afraid of losing big speaking fees and not being invited on FOX and other media. Could this be self interest over principles?

  17. Yamit, the 100?s of posted articles on Israpundit that you refer to as supporting your claim that “99% of all Muslims being of the Jihadist-fundamentalist Muslim variety” are your own.

    What hubris!

    Actually you are really mistaken on this point. I have for the most part been quite reserved in addressing Islam per se’.

    I concentrated my comments to our direct enemies who are Muslim but my emphasis was quite distant from commenting specifically about Islam.

    Google Israpuindit+Islam

    I expect your new BFF wannabe Max, will still think you are cool.

    I thought that was ron? I too have no idea what BFF refers to so I Googled it and the only definitions that seems to make any sense to your ref. is: Backup File Format or Binary Format File, Oh well, nothing else you write is comprehensible either.

  18. From seeing the Terry Jones fallout, I’m beginning to think the Islamic resistance in America is growing.

    Am I wrong about that?

  19. This is a very sickening and disturbing situation. When “activists” like Gabriel, and others on the “right”, jump on the leftist PC bandwagon to condemn Pastor Jones, they are only emboldening our Enemy. They think that they will look “moderate” in the eyes of the leftist/Islamist camp that hate their guts anyway. I am really ticked off and furious at Brigitte Gabriel who sent out an e-mail vehemently condemning the Pastor. If it wasn’t coming from ACT! For America, one would have thought that some leftist fascist had written it.

    I don’t like burning books. It’s been done to us in the past by both Christians and Muslims. But Gabriel – who is a supposed friend of Israel – should understand that whether we in America like it or not, Jones can do with the koran as he pleases. Just like the communists who burn the Bible and the American flag. The outrage by the Obama regime and his puppets would make someone wonder that WWIII was about to begin. To think that Gates and Petraeus would get involved in this is not to be believed. Where were they when that Muslim mass murderer slaughtered all those American soldiers at Fort Hood?

    And where is the outrage when the Muslims burn the Bible in Sa’udi-Occupied Arabia and Afghanistan? They even burn the bibles when they are written in the “holy” Arabic language, or in Farsi or Dari. Not a word out of the Obamanites, and not a word (that I know of) out of ACT! Shameful, stupid, idiotic, and imbecilic. The apoplectic attack on the part of Gabriel and ACT! is going to backfire on them. “Useful idiots.” They should be ashamed of themselves.

  20. BN your viewpoints are 100 percent in line with Canada’s HRC an agency which actively empowers Islamofascism and suppresses Canadian Free speech, and also in line with Bush Junior and many other such of that ilk.

    And you spend about 90 percent of your time on this site attacking pro Israeli posters.
    (And try to remember , that’s because you don’t have a voice in the MSM and try to realize why that is and realize that the audinece there is the people that need to be “convinced” of something.)

    Of course (said in soothing tone) you are “working” to help Israel as you previously stated

    just saying…

    ====================================

    I had to look up BFF on google I guess it is a suitable acronym adolescents use.

    One person simply agrees with another on some particular strategies. Stop being so silly with the BFF stuff.

  21. Yamit, the 100’s of posted articles on Israpundit that you refer to as supporting your claim that “99% of all Muslims being of the Jihadist-fundamentalist Muslim variety” are your own.

    What hubris!

    It is the height of arrogant conceit that you would cite yourself as your expert authority for your own views. Not impressive Yamit, though I expect your new BFF wannabe Max, will still think you are cool.

  22. chbd says:
    As an American I stand by the American constitution that safeguards all religious freedoms.

    Too bad you don’t also stand by American democratic freedom of speech which in no way threatens religious freedom.

    And also too bad you stand for religious oppression of the freedom of speech.

    —-

    I sweepingly denounce all religions.
    If you don’t like that – tough tiddley winks – get used to diversity.

    I think all you people with imaginary friends are destructive fools.

    However I grant you the freedom to say and believe whatever you want including insulting and burning the symbols I like, so long as you stay out of my real life and my real freedoms.

    ..which I apparently I don’t think you want to – you just enunciated a manifesto of tyranny and oppression.

  23. Well said Yamit.
    In Canada in public we have to talk like Narvey and alway use the preface “Jihadist-fundamentalist”. Otherwise he will be prosecuted by the HRC stripped of his $$$ and personal possessions and forced to write a letter of apology. Don’t blame him, he is only following orders.

    Oh and BN, I wouldn’t like Yamit’s pea pod unless he has copies of Richard Dawkins books and a portrait of Moshe Ya’alon in a holy place and even then I would prefer my own pea pod.

    lol

  24. As an American Jew, I know what it is like to be attacked verbally and otherwise for my religion. I resent deeply the sweeping denunciation of any religion. We Jews by and large stand in solidarity with those minorities that feel the sting of bigotry and it matters little who they may be- Roma, blacks, Jews, Hispanics and yes Muslims. Shame om you all for acting like antisemites, like the Klan, and American Nazis. Narvey, I salute your courage. As an American I stand by the American constitution that safeguards all religious freedoms.

  25. Narvey if you say Jihadist-fundamentalist Muslim one more time I will start writing letters to all your contacts saying Jihadist-fundamentalist Muslims: Narvey. Enough with your obtuse defense of your own intellectually blind liberal PC mental block. It’s just Islam and just Muslims being or behaving as normal Muslims; by prefixing the word Muslim with Jihadist-fundamentalist, you presuppose that most Muslims are not Jihadist-fundamentalist Muslims, yet you have never supplied any support for your fallacious opinion that there are in fact a majority of Muslims who are not Jihadist-fundamentalist Muslims, this despite the hundreds of posted articles and comments here on Israpundit that have shown the majority: like 99% of all Muslims being of the Jihadist-fundamentalist Muslim variety.

  26. Ted, you are way off base. Read my words again, but this time in the context of the whole of my comment.

    Nothing I said amounts to blaming the West for the way Jihadists and their sympathizers think and for what ill they think of the West. I simply explained how I understand these Muslim Jihadists and fundamentalists think.

    I did however, go on to say that the West’s appeasement policies towards Muslims has been self defeating. These policies achieve more bad then good. The bad is that the Jihadists and their Muslim fundamentalist sympathizers are encouraged to believe they are winning. They are being energized to redouble their efforts, be it on the battlefield, stealth Jihad or pressing for greater concessions from the West. The success of these Jihadists and fundamentalist Muslim sympathizers has also resulted in greater numbers of Muslims being drawn to support them.

    Because the West remains willfully blind to that reality, stressing the word “willfully” and thus stays its self defeating course in dealing with the Muslim world in general and the Middle East in particular, the West must bear some responsibility for the threat and manifest violence from these Jihadists, increasing.

    As many have said, the West must wake up to the Jihadist-fundamentalist Muslim threat and change course to become far more aggressive. That aggression would find expression in the West denying Jihadist-fundamentalist Muslim demands for concessions and accommodation and in the West using whatever economic and military leverage and advantage they have, to ensure the Jihadists and their sympathizers are set back on their heels and then put down.

  27. If I threatened to burn Anton LaVey’s Satanic rituals , no one would care.
    Why not? I would be insulting his followers?
    This is all hypocrisy, it is all about power and not about principle.

    If all of Islam was just one person and that one person was just myself – the whole world would have mo trouble insulting me or even stomping me into nothingness.

    The true “holy” symbols here are corruption power, wealth, and bullying by force of numbers.

    Debbie may be somewhat wild but the value of such people is that they can see, think and write about things that other people can’t because of their fears and emotional blinders.

    I’m glad I read that article, it explains puts together a lot and points to a common anomalies happing across the board.
    When people sell us out “to fight a better war” they are not fighting for us any more. Whatever they are fighting for , is for some twisted agenda of their own.

    What is primarily important is if an expert is fighting, struggling for me, my rights and my civilization. If so I will listen to their expertise no matter who they are. I am unlikely to want to listen or care if they toss me to the lions over a hypocritical “political correctness”.

    Freedom is not an argument. I don’t want to “convince” anyone of anything. I don’t care what their blah blah arguments are. Freedom and the free right of expression is something you have to take and keep.

    Of course it is not a a major catastrophe but it is a yellow blinking light. You got “warriors” who will sell us out on a dime for some ulterior motives. Break out the grains of salt!

    I would have liked to have seen that email lol . It would have been fun to read.

  28. Narvey

    We have seen that the Jihadists, their fundamentalist Muslim sympathizers and even many Muslims who are described as moderate, even though in a number of instances they prove they are not, project onto the West, their own intolerant hate filled views.

    It matters not that the vast majority of Westerners display only tolerance and sensitivity to Muslims. It takes only a few Westerners who speak out against Jihadists or who are critical of Islam, to constitute clear proof to these Jihadists and their sympathizers that the West is anti-Muslim and at war with Islam. Further, where the Jihadists attack Western targets, they claim they are justified. When the West counter attacks, the Jihadists claim that they are being attacked for no reason other then the West’s war with Islam and the Muslim world.

    Please reconsider your words. You are blaming the West for the ill feelings the Muslims have to us. We all know that their ill feelings have nothing to do with what you allege but with the dictates of their religion.

    That is a liberal view. I.e. we are to blame.

    We aren’t.

  29. General Petraeus should shut the f up. He spoke out that Israel was endangering his troops and now that Koran burning is too. His job is to fight and not go public. He is Obama’s stooge. General Petraeus’ Mistake.

    It is legal to build the mosque and to burn the Koran. Nevertheless many have asked both actors to stand down. So to that extent the analogy is right on. In Palin’s case she asked Rauf to stand down. She strengthens her case in something of trivial importance by asking Jones to stand down also. Why give a mixed message. It only weakens the mosque argument. Jones said to Rauf if you stand down I will. Nothing came of that.

    But the problem is with the liberals who didn’t ask Rauf to stand down and in fact supported his legal right. Those same supporters switched gears on Jones. They are the hypocrits.

    Burning a Koran aside from symbollicly rejecting Islam, is also a reassertion of your right of free speech and rejection of PC.

    Finally reading a Koran and burning a Koran are not mutually exclusive. You can do both.

  30. You could have skipped the history and presentation of all sides according to your flawed understanding of them and just typed the last two lines.

    Now if you read what you wrote carefully you last statement made several assumptions. That the west can still change course, from appeasement
    Until the West does change course however, the West is will continue to fear that the words and deeds of just one amongst them, such as Pastor Jones’, can only bring the West more danger and undermine the West’s efforts to win hearts and minds.

    To What? Pastor Jones is a danger to world security or a best to some peoples security? That Muslim hearts and minds can be changed from what to what?

    None of your last assumptions are true. America is not fighting to win, they are fighting for very avaricious reasons and in the case of the Afghans you can’t tell me that a few hundred al-queda terrorists who apparently are still humming, justified An American invasion, billions of wasted dollars many innocents and American troops dead? The Taliban were never a threat to America they belong to the internal politics of the country. America needed in short a friendly government in Kabul who would allow gas and oil pipelines to be built through Afghanistan from the Cacauses who are land locked like Afghanistan. These plans and threats were in place before 9/11 and I have posted from the congressional record 2-3 times here on Israpundit proof of what I say here. Wars are good for certain Businesses in America and there is that economic consideration as well.

    No one to date has been able to answer my question as to why America did not seek some repayment for expenses, from Iraqi oil sales. Iraq with the second most oil reserves after the Saudis? Who is getting the Iraqi oil revenues?

    Hearts and minds of those in the ME are not to be won. Certainly not by foreign armies who invaded and control their country, killed their relatives and destroyed a good deal of their country.

    You spout as mantra what you glean from the MSM. That shows who and what you are.

  31. Narvey, lays out a reasond case against burning the Koran. However, a strategy of respect toward Islam has its problems:

    It takes only a few Westerners who speak out against Jihadists or who are critical of Islam, to constitute clear proof to these Jihadists and their sympathizers that the West is anti-Muslim and at war with Islam.

    Westerners don’t even have to speak out against Islam. If they but live their lives they will incur the rage of Islam. The smut coming out of the San Fernando Valley and Hollywood makes its way around the world threatens the ‘purity’ of Islamic youth; they hate us for that. They hate us for a million other things besides, basically, everything we stand for or do.

    If peace with Islam rests upon the deeds a few westerners, we are doomed already. You will always have a minority of outspoken dissenters and activists in a free society who oppose and desecrate everything. You can’t keep a lid on it.

    It was said that burning the Koran would give jhadis propaganda material. While this is true, they are already propagandizing their people. They don’t rely on truth to do that either. Even if you show all the respect in the world to Islam, they will fabricate lies against you if you are not Muslim. Since that’s the case anyway; we might as well be the ones to choose what they will present to their followers—burning the Koran sends a much more constructive message than the porn coming out of the entertainment industry.

    If we are going to be hated to the point we must be destroyed, why make ourselves deserving? Why not be hated for exposing evil rather than being evil?

  32. I disagree and am disappointed with conservatives who attacked pastor Jones. But for “View from the Right” to dismiss them as frauds altogether and declare them the enemy is wrong.

  33. [LA replies: I have sometimes wondered how much of Palin’s Facebook essays were written by her, and how much by a ghost writer. In my opinion, this one is clearly the work of a ghost writer.]

    If one disagrees with Sarah Palin, fine. But I’m really sick of the portrayal of her as being unintelligent. Where does this false image come from? One need only research on the outstanding job she did running Alaska.

  34. Those that took issue with that fairly universal condemnation of Pastor Jones answered Petraeus’ concerns by saying the troops are already in danger, so what’s a bit more?

    You miss the point. The koran burning did not put our troops in any more danger. However American leadership’s public display of fear and panic, including from a general of all people, is what is truly putting America in greater peril. When you display weakness, that is what emboldens our enemies. A more appropriate response from our leaders would have been “although I disagree with the act of burning the koran, it is the right to do so under our constitutional guarantee of freedom of expression. Muslims are going to have to get used to it. Being offended is no excuse for violent savagery and we will unleash the full force of the American military in response to any violence against Americans”.
    .

  35. She also said she loves Muslims and I believe her don’t you?

    If the protest of the ground zero mosque is against Islam I am for the protest. If it is just as she claims an insensitive thing to do because of the victims and has no problem, as she says with them building a Mosque 50 meters from the site then her protest is not anti Islam and she is at best a PC phony. You and Ted can make excuses for Palin as a politician but Geller and the other non politicians? Either they don’t completely understand the threat, are PC out of fear, or the have a different agenda and are using the Islam, and Muslim issue to generate business?

    Once you begin to compromise on principles, ideology and truth it’s a fast slide down hill. look at Foxman!

  36. Gen. Petraeus stated that Jones’ book burning stunt was endangering his troops. The Obama administration saw it that way and appealed in a telephone call to Jones to desist. Many American politicians and pundits across the political spectrum, saw truth in Petraeus’ words and they all pretty much condemned Jones as being an anti-Muslim bigot.

    Those that took issue with that fairly universal condemnation of Pastor Jones answered Petraeus’ concerns by saying the troops are already in danger, so what’s a bit more?

    The reality is that not only is America in Afghanistan to defeat the Taliban and wreak havoc and death if possible, on al Qaeda, they are also out to try to win the hearts and minds of Afghanis as they are in Iraq and by means other then war, in other parts of the Middle East.

    We have seen in past how a relatively few fundamentalist Muslims roused the passions and anger of a very great many millions of Muslims in the Middle East and the West over things like the Mohammed Cartoons, the Van Gough – Hirsi Ali and Geert Wilders’ movies on Islam and even America aiding Israel more then the Muslim world could bear.

    What those few fundamentalist Muslims did, was play upon the themes still very much a fact in Islamic culture, such as Muslim victimhood at the hands of the West, the Crusades are not over yet, the West is making war on Islam and the Muslim world, etc.

    The result was that Muslim boycotts, that millions of Muslims supported at the call of their fundamentalist Muslim leaders, was the least of the problems.

    Muslim violence ensued. People were murdered and maimed. Al Qaeda and other Jihadist groups saw each of these acts that were critical of them or Islam as an unforgivable insult to them and Islam and it amounted to an affirmation of their views that the West, led by America is at war with Islam.

    We saw on 9/11 not just Palestinians, but other Middle Eastern Muslims dancing for joy in their streets and praising the boldness of Al qaeda.

    We have seen that the Jihadists, their fundamentalist Muslim sympathizers and even many Muslims who are described as moderate, even though in a number of instances they prove they are not, project onto the West, their own intolerant hate filled views.

    It matters not that the vast majority of Westerners display only tolerance and sensitivity to Muslims. It takes only a few Westerners who speak out against Jihadists or who are critical of Islam, to constitute clear proof to these Jihadists and their sympathizers that the West is anti-Muslim and at war with Islam. Further, where the Jihadists attack Western targets, they claim they are justified. When the West counter attacks, the Jihadists claim that they are being attacked for no reason other then the West’s war with Islam and the Muslim world.

    In this regard there is compelling evidence that the Jihadists and their sympathizers engage in thinking akin to self fulfilling prophesies.

    It is against this background of Muslim sensitivities, sensibilities, beliefs and opinions that Gen. Petraeus and American politicians and pundits across the political spectrum would see the intended act of Pastor Jones to burn the Koran as not only endangering American troops, but undermining American efforts to win the hearts and minds of the Muslim world.

    Had the West from the get go, met Jihadist and fundamentalist Muslim hatred and intolerance and the violence that ensued against the West, with imposition of tough painful sanctions, unequivocal rejection of Muslim hatred and intolerance of non-Muslims and crushing military action, we would not be in the situation we are today.

    Western policies of appeasement and accommodation in the hope that such efforts will win all the Muslim world over to see we Westerners are not what the Jihadists and fundamentalist Muslims see us as, have not worked. Instead these feckless policies have only encouraged these Jihadists to believe they can get what they want through aggressive demands, threats of violence and actual violence.

    It is not too late for the West to change course in dealing with these Jihadist purveyors of angry hatred and intolerance for the West.

    Until the West does change course however, the West is will continue to fear that the words and deeds of just one amongst them, such as Pastor Jones’, can only bring the West more danger and undermine the West’s efforts to win hearts and minds.

  37. The failure to burn the Koran and the suppression of our basic freedom to criticize and to insult shows that North American has been successfully terrorized and compromised. It is all about oil wealth, if it was the symbol of some third rate country , no one would care.

    I’m glad to say that there WERE koran burnings around the nation. The sky didn’t fall.

  38. Brigette Gabriel, as a Christian from Lebanon, is a voice we desperately need to teach Americans about the horrors of islam. Debbie Schussel is doing the job of dividing the anti-jihad alliance. This koran burning represents a minor disagreement amongst us.

  39. Pam Geller DEFENDED pastor Jones’ first amendment right to burn the koran. She only said that it was a stupid and counterproductive idea. Some commenters even here on israpundit condemned Jones. Pam has been a fierce fighter against the islamization of the west as has Malkin and Gabriel. I don’t think because of a minor disagreement, we should be putting them down as a whole.

  40. My complaint with Debbie was not over her attitude to Koran burning but her vicious attack on Gabriel. In my opinion it was uncalled for.

    I think Palin, Beck, Gabriel, and some others who have spoken out against burning the Koran really believe in a non-physically active approach. They sincerely believe fighting with logic and arguments is the most effective and civil way to oppose Islamic terrorism. I don’t rank on them for their conclusions, but I do not think the strategy they advocate is strong enough to win.

    The problem, as I wrote previously, is the western mindset. We have been programed to believe that we can say anything, but we cannot do anything—even if what we do is a statement of what we are are willing to say.

    If I can say the Koran is a book that preaches violence and it should be burned, why can’t I burn it? As a sheep, you are allowed to complain, but you can’t do anything to avoid slaughter without being labeled a racist, bigot, or kook.

    My first reaction to burning the Koran publicly was apprehension. But if in every place in the west, people began burning them today, I would see it as a sign that civilization is waking up.

  41. It’s just like the Ground Zero mosque plan. Does this church have the right? – Glen Beck

    No Glen, burning the Koran is not “just like” building a mosque at Ground Zero. People are confusing them as being the same because both acts are provocative. What makes them different is one is a celebration of victory upon the graves of innocents, and the other is a denunciation of it.

    We are taught in the West to give all ideas equal space and equal rights, to respect all beliefs regardless if we embrace them or not. It should be evident that some ideas do not deserve a place in public other than bonfire.

    Why should a message of genocide and servitude be placed on the same level or compared to a message of life and liberty?

    Actually, they are not; Islam is given more respect.

  42. Three Big Cheers to Debbi Schlussel, She was right about those self serving frauds. When Pam Geller says: “she has nothing against Muslims and even loves Muslims” you can take that comment to the bank. She like some PC fraudulent conservative pundits and activists are still either blind cowed or corrupted in not seeing that there is no fundamental difference between believing Muslims and all Nazi didn’t look and act like the Gestapo and SS. Seems like for some conservative political activists, Their activism is a lucrative business.

  43. Think about what the Koran says. Burning the Koran is not the same as burning the flag, or the US Constitution, or the Bible, as some would have you think. The message of the Koran is totally the opposite of freedom, life and liberty. There is no moral equivalence between those who burn the Koran and those who burn symbols and documents of freedom.

    I think that Westerners have been so conditioned that even conservatives for the most part cannot distinguish the great gulf separating freedom of speech and religion, from treasonous dogmas of totalitarianism—whether they be from Islamic fundamentalists or extremist on the left. People who actively practice the antithesis of freedom in have no right to destroy our freedom in the name of it. Political correctness is endangering all of civilization right now.

  44. Pastor Jones and his congregation are stooping to the tactics of and joining the inarticulate who express their anger and opposition through destructive and spiteful acts of denigration. What is the difference between his actions and the actions of Islamists destroying synagogues in Gaza or churches and Bibles in Lebanon, Bosnia and Egypt? We are better than that as Americans.

    Always devoted,

    Brigitte Gabriel

    (The difference is that the Korans. meaningless bundles of reprintable paper, belonged to him and were on his property and nobody’s business but his if he wants to burn them. that’s the difference – that’s called freedom.)

    I now curse Brigitte Gabriel. If fascists are American then she is American. She wants to sell me out so the Islamofascists can have her and everyone like her. She has brought them on herself and upon the innocent as well – whatever Islamofascists do to such people, they deserve it – like deserves like.

    It doesn’t matter that Terry Jones was a kook or why he wanted to burn the Koran it was his freedom to do so and that is the fundamental freedom upon which Democracy is based free speech and free expression without which democracy will wither and die.
    Just because some group has a lot of oil does not mean they have the right to selectively suppress our democratic rights.
    He had the right to express himself by doing so and when his freedom was squashed they took away the freedom of all of us and terrorized all of us with Islam.

  45. I agree entirely with Debbie Schlussel and with Stogie, IE :

    The mass denunciations of Pastor Jones by the right blogosphere were really eye-opening. Many of them, maybe most of them, are as chicken-hearted as the Left. I am disillusioned and disgusted.

    Every single one of those individuals listed as well as quite a few individuals on this site, just sold out or were willing to sell out my personal freedom and made me a victim of Islamification. They have all compromised with evil. Debbie Schlussel acts as an individual and is free to speak the truth – all the rest of them have compromised with fascism and made deals with various groups for their own personal advancement. They are all contaminated.
    They have achieved the success of fascism.

    This certifies to me that the entire society I live in is a dangerous to all ordinary citizens and the leaderships is corrupt from top to bottom.

    This is a watermark showing that we have now entered a new stage of active Islamification.

    The failure to burn the Koran and the suppression of our basic freedom to criticize and to insult shows that North American has been successfully terrorized and compromised. It is all about oil wealth, if it was the symbol of some third rate country , no one would care.

    Buchanan urges Obama to arrest Pastor Jones

    Haha and I formerly joked that Obama might arrest Terry Jones and send him to Tehran for beheading.

    A joke it is not and that will be the future.